-
IJA Units & Markings
-
- Topics:
- JIAAF Order of Battle - malaya
(New)
- intercepts over the Hump
(New)
- Interceptors of Doolittle Raider 40-2250
(New)
- INFORMATION NEEDED!!!!!
(New)
- Pailuchi A/F 1943.12.15
(New)
-
-
- Posted By:
James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
- Date:
Saturday, 13 April 2002, at 1:30 p.m.
-
- I recently
acquired a set of aircraft fragments from a Japanese aircraft collected in
China in 1945. Two are from the hinomaru and only offer the standard
"red" documented for this marking.
-
- However, one
fragment (see below) has the remnants of a warning message, probably,
"SAWARUNA." I believe this fragment to have been taken from a IJAAF
aircraft. There is no primer coat and no aotake/aodake applied to the reverse
side. The green camouflage is a close match to FS-34094.
-
- I believe
this is a fragment from a late-war Nakajima Ki-84 Frank or a Tachikawa
constructed Ki-43 Oscar.
-
- My question
is, was the warning "SAWARUNA" ever applied to any part/place on a
IJAAF fighter other than the trim tabs?
-
- Perhaps the
warning on the fragment below is something other than "SAWARUNA"?
-
- Thank you
for any and all help!
-
- Editors
note: Picture at http://www.j-aircraft.com/jiml/sawaruna.jpg
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-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage Color Approximations
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- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Sunday, 14 April 2002, at 2:14 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
-
- I went
through my FS color references and my paint collection to find something close
to your artifact out of the bottle.
-
- Eyeballing
it, two Testors Model Master II colors that look close are:
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- 2106 French
Khaki
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- 2129 Russian
Armor Green
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- There is no
FS 34094 in the Testors line. Comparing Munsell values for FS34094 yields a
similar shade in FS34097 (a little lighter) which is available in the original
Model Master series as:
-
- 1712 Field
Green FS34097
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- To me, the
first two colors (2106 and 2129) come closer to your artifact photo as viewed
on my computer.
-
- Just in case
anyone's interested.
-
- Does anyone
have any other matches/similarities?
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-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed!
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- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date: Saturday,
13 April 2002, at 2:46 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
-
- Nice colour
sample! Thanks for sharing it with us.
-
- Some
locations I know of - subject to the size of your sample - on the Hayate wing
upper surface the leading edge fuel tank - on the Hayabusa the elevator trim
tabs and the wing upper surfaces above the "butterfly" flaps.
-
- My guess
from the colours, but again subject to size, would be the Hayate leading edge
markings. That's a green colour I associate with Hayate.
-
-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed!
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- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Saturday, 13 April 2002, at 8:24 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (Nick Millman)
-
- According to
FAOW #19, the Hayate wing leading edge fuel tank upper surface stencil should
read "no ru na", vice "sa wa ru na". The only "sa wa
ru na" stencil I can find on the Hayate is the rudder trim tab. No
stencils are called out for the Hayate's aileron tabs in any of my references.
-
- A quick
check through Model Art 329 shows the "sa wa ru na" katakana
characters are also used on Ki-61 rudder and aileron trim tabs.
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-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed!
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Sunday, 14 April 2002, at 12:56 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (Bill Leyh)
-
- yes, I
missed the significance of the left hand character but as it is incomplete
anyway caution is warranted!
-
- My gut feeling
is still Hayate. I'd expect to see Hayabusa and Shoki in non-factory schemes
over natural metal or primed natural metal. Hayate had a factory paint job with
stencils commonly in red and the variagation is typical.
-
- However -
take a look at page 212 of Pacific War Eagles. A Hayabusa II Kai at Kimpo in an
overall green scheme missing a few bits of skin! A Hayate sits behind it. This
discussion is moving us towards late war "browns" and I'm not even
going to go there! I promise to be good!
-
- Another Nick
waiting to be shot down!!!
-
-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed!
-
- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Sunday, 14 April 2002, at 2:02 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (Nick Millman)
-
- I agree it's
most likely a Hayate - based on what I saw in the books plus the factory paint
scheme. It doesn't look as though the Hayabusa had any such stencils on any of
it's variants. It's possible it could be a late production Ki-44 in factory
paint.
-
- I listed all
the occurrances I could find in my library so Jim might get a better idea of
the possibilitites.
-
- I know the
War Eagles photo you mentioned. There certainly seems to be no shortage of
paint schemes, eh?
-
-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed!
-
- Posted By:
James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
- Date:
Saturday, 13 April 2002, at 8:15 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (Nick Millman)
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- I think the
l/e fuel tanks on the Frank had markings which read "NORUNA".
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-
Re:
IJAAF Markings - Addendum
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- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Saturday, 13 April 2002, at 8:40 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (James F. Lansdale)
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- FAOW #16
(Ki-44) has callouts for "sa wa run na" stencils in the following
locations:
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- Rudder trim
tab
-
- Left and
right aileron trim tabs
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- Left and
right elevator trim tabs
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- Note that
this is for an UNPAINTED Ki-44. There are no such drawings or photographs for
the factory painted models. I would assume (but you know what that means) that
the same stencils were applied to the factory painted planes.
-
- Hope this
helps. And thank you VERY much for the excellent color reference!
-
-
Re:
IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed!
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- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Saturday, 13 April 2002, at 8:28 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (James F. Lansdale)
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- Read my
response to Nick. Also, can you scan a ruler along with the artifact and post
that? Without a scale reference, it appears to be too large to be a piece of a
trim tab.
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-
Re:
"SAWARUNA?" Marking To Scale *PIC*
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- Posted By:
James F. Lansdale <LRAJIM@aol.com>
- Date:
Sunday, 14 April 2002, at 7:51 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: IJAAF Camouflage: Markings I.D. Help Needed! (Bill Leyh)
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- Here ya go
Bill!
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- Thank you
for your help. I appreciate it very much!
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- Editors
note: Picture at http://www.j-aircraft.com/jiml/sawaruna_scale.jpg
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-
Re:
"SAWARUNA?" Need one more scan...
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- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Sunday, 14 April 2002, at 8:37 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: "SAWARUNA?" Marking To Scale *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
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- Not a
problem!
-
- Will the
entire piece, including all the edges, fit on your scanner bed so you could
post a pic of the whole thing? That way I can do some measurements.
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- With what I
see so far I can't tell if it's larger than it should be for a trim tab. It's
close.
-
-
Re:
"SAWARUNA?" Here's my guess...
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- Posted By:
Bill Leyh <hawk81@pacbell.net>
- Date:
Sunday, 14 April 2002, at 9:18 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: "SAWARUNA?" Marking To Scale *PIC* (James F. Lansdale)
-
- Ok, based on
the full artifact scan you sent here's what I think:
-
- It's a piece
of a Ki-84 Hayate elevator trim tab. The piece is too large (top to bottom) to
be any of the other trim tabs. It's the wrong set of characters to be from the
wing leading edge fuel tank (and I also suspect the characters are too small
for that). Although none of the reference drawings I have show a stencil for
the Ki-84 elevator trim tabs, if you look in FAOW #19, page 69, top photo, you
can see the "sa wa ru na" stencil on the elevator trim tab just to
the left of the pilot's right hip pocket.
-
- That's my
guess and I'm stickin' to it!
-
-
- Posted By:
Scott Spencer <sspencer302@charter.net>
- Date: Tuesday,
14 May 2002, at 10:54 a.m.
-
- Can anyone
give me the best reference, for colors and markings, for the units that were
stationed in Sumatra during the 1943 - 1945 time frame? I want to build a Ki-43
and Ki-84 from those units that faced the RN East Indies Fleet during this long
period. I'm just not sure what mark of Ki-43 and Ki-84, as well as markings,
were flown from these bases. Any suggestions are appreciated deeply!
-
-
Richard
Dunn is your man!
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Wednesday, 15 May 2002, at 12:21 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Best Ref for JAAF Units in Sumatra? (Scott Spencer)
-
- I suspect
Richard Dunn is your man for this. I believe there is a Japanese monograph on
the subject but I don't have it.
-
- 87th Sentai
with Ki-44's were there - and I believe took part in opposing the RN attacks.
33rd with Ki-43 were there during the summer of 1944.
-
- In June 1943
2nd Chutai of 64th Sentai moved from Burma to Palembang for the rainy season.
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- The old
Aircam has a lovely brown Ki-84 of the 24th Independent Chutai in Sumatra,
Spring 1945 but I cannot vouch for the accuracy.
-
-
Re:
Best Ref for JAAF Units in Sumatra?
-
- Posted By:
John MacGregor <JohnMacG6@hotmail.com>
- Date:
Tuesday, 14 May 2002, at 3:16 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Best Ref for JAAF Units in Sumatra? (Scott Spencer)
-
- I'd think
that you can forget the Ki84 being in Sumatra. Sumatra really was the end of
the line for the JAAF by the end of the war, what air units there were in S.
had been pulled back to Singapore and Thailand.
- JAAF fighter
Sentais in Thailand (the 13th and 64th?) were supposedly just beginning to
receive Ki84s right at the war's end.
-
-
NW
Sumatra
-
- Posted By:
richard dunn <rdunn@rhsmith.umd.edu>
- Date:
Wednesday, 15 May 2002, at 6:52 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Best Ref for JAAF Units in Sumatra? (Scott Spencer)
-
- Unfortunately
I cannot justify Nick's confidence but I do have a little info.
-
- The Japanese
Navy provided air defence for NW Sumatra from Summer 1943 to Feb 44 with its
331 kokutai equipped with Zero 21s. Various Japanese Army air units provided
air defense in the general Palembang area. Palembang was not attacked by Royal
Navy carrier aircraft until Jan 45.
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- At the time
of the carrier raids against NW Sumatra (Sabang, Kota Radja area) in April,
June and July 44 there do not seem to have been any regular JAAF fighter units
assigned permanently to that area. Detachments from the Palembang area may have
moved into the area in response to British raids.
-
- The
principal units on Sumatra were 87 FR (Ki 44) from Dec 43 to Spring 1945 and 33
FR, Palembang area, June-Oct 44 (Ki 43-II) and Sumatra-Andamans area Jan-July
45 (Ki 44). Several other units had short tours in the Palembang area.
-
- Hope this
little bit helps. Good luck.
-
-
Re:
NW Sumatra
-
- Posted By:
Scott Spencer <sspencer302@charter.net>
- Date:
Wednesday, 15 May 2002, at 2:42 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: NW Sumatra (richard dunn)
-
- THANK YOU
very much for the information. As I posted to John MacGregor's reply below, I
was interested in the summer of '44 forays by the RN. I am also interested in
the Palembang raids when the EIF/BPF was in route to the Pacific in early 1945.
-
- Essentially,
I am desiring to model some of the units that faced the EIF/BPF during
1944/1945. I have modeled the FAA aircraft of the period and wanted to model
their nemisis.
-
- Is their a
reference (either in book or on the internet) for the particular markings and
paint schemes of the units you mentioned? Finding out what the aircraft looked
like is my first challenge and then finding 1:48 scale decals of those markings
is my second challenge.
-
- Your help is
greatly appreciated!
-
-
Re:
NW Sumatra
-
- Posted By:
richard dunn <rdunn@rhsmith.umd.edu>
- Date:
Wednesday, 15 May 2002, at 3:44 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: NW Sumatra (Scott Spencer)
-
- I often
confess, "I'm not a markings guy." If I don't others will point it
out.
-
- As far as I
know 33d FR continued to use its stylized triangle mark (curved hypotenuse and
indented vertical} after leaving the SE Area and rebuilding in Sumatra on both its
type 1 and type 2 fighters. I welcome corrections.
-
- 87th FR had
a more boomerang looking marking. Whole leading edge of tail fin colored and
then curved sweep back to the rudder. I believe the same marking was used from
late 42 to 45. This is just from published sources. I have no special info.
Others can probably help out.
-
-
Re:
NW Sumatra
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Thursday, 16 May 2002, at 8:35 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: NW Sumatra (richard dunn)
-
- Two of the
Fine Molds 1/48th scale Ki-43 Oscar kits offer decals for 33rd Sentai aircraft.
-
- Kit FB 3, a
Ki-43 III Ko, has markings for the aicraft flown by Lt Hitoshi Yamamoto, a
Bukosho winner, of the 3rd Chutai, 33rd Sentai, from "Bireum"
airfield, Sumatra in October 1944. The colour scheme is plain
"late-war" khaki-green uppersurfaces and natural metal undersurfaces.
The unit "twin-three" marking is yellow. This particular aircraft is
also illustrated in colour in Model Art 416 "Medaled Pilots of Japanese
Army Air Force in World War II" (page 6).
-
- Kit FB 4, a
late production Ki-43 II, has markings for the aicraft of the 1st Chutai
leader, Capt Kiyoshi Namai, at "Gernbang" airfield, Sumatra in the
summer of 1944. The colour scheme is dark green mottle over natural metal. The
"twin-three" marking is in white outlined red and the aircraft has a
wide white fuselage band, also outlined in red. This aircraft is illustrated in
colour in Model Art 395 "Camouflage & Markings of Type 1 Fighter
Hayabusa" (page 11) together with other 33rd Sentai examples.
-
- I can't find
those particular airfields on Geoff Thomas' excellent map of Sumatran and
Javanese airfields or anywhere on my own 1920's maps so perhaps they are also
known by other names? I believe the Fine Molds kits are still available from
Hobby Link Japan. Aeromaster also produced 3 sets of decals for the Ki-43 and
some of those may be relevant and could be used with the old Otaki or new
Hasegawa kit (if you like it!)
-
- In January,
1943 five Ki-44's had been issued to the predominantly Oscar equipped 33rd
Sentai at Wuchang, China. These aircraft were used to form a special Ki-44
Shotai under Maj Akira Watanabe, the Sentai commander. Colour schemes for the
Ki-44 in 33rd Sentai service are obscure.
-
- The Ki-44's
of the 87th Sentai appear to have been in natural metal with deep green mottles
in various styles on the upper surfaces. Some aircraft also appear to be in a
very worn deep green finish with large areas of natural metal showing. The
Sentai also used 40mm cannon armed versions of the Ki-44. Unusual fuselage
striping was applied to some aircraft, probably to denote Chutai and Hentai
leadership. The "Spirit of the Wind" tail marking, which is
relatively easy to hand paint, was blue for the 1st Chutai, red for the 2nd
Chutai and yellow for the 3rd Chutai. It was common practice in this unit for
the spinner and 40mm wing cannon fairings to be painted in the Chutai colours
too.
-
-
Re:
NW Sumatra
-
- Posted By:
Scott Spencer <sspencer302@charter.net>
- Date:
Wednesday, 15 May 2002, at 4:51 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: NW Sumatra (richard dunn)
-
- I admit a
lot of ignorance about Japanese aircraft and units so can I ask a stupid
question?? What does FR stand for?
-
- Thank you
for the assistance and maybe someone will step up and offer sources or where I
can find the decals for these units.
-
-
Re:
NW Sumatra
-
- Posted By:
richard dunn <rdunn@rhsmith.umd.edu>
- Date:
Wednesday, 15 May 2002, at 6:09 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: NW Sumatra (Scott Spencer)
-
- I'll try not
to get too complicated. FR stands for Hiko Sentai or Flying Regiment (sort of).
FR originally stood for Hiko Rentai (a flying unit with an attached airfield
battalion) this was a real Regiment (Rentai was the ground Army term for
Regiment). During the China war there was a reorganization of JAAF units.
Airfield Battalions were generally detached from Flying Regiments and these new
smaller units (generally three flying squadrons and a small maintenance and
admin unit) were redesignated "Sentai" rather than "Rentai"
but so were some units that kept their Airfield Battalions.
-
- The official
abbreviation for Hiko Rentai had been FR. The new abbreviation for Hiko Sentai
became F. Despite this official change the abbreviation FR was VERY commonly
used during WW2 for Hiko Sentai. After WW2 the Japanese official historians
used "F" and many other hitorians have followed suit. 33d F is
technically the correct abbreviation for 33d Hiko Sentai. 33d FR is an
historically accurate abbreviation for 33d Hiko Sentai.
-
- Probably a
minor point and possibly more than you really wanted to know but since I use
both conventions from time to time I thought I'd answer this way.
-
- If I've
gotten any of the above garbled perhaps someone else can straighten this out.
-
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Tuesday, 21 May 2002, at 1:43 a.m.
-
- Special
envoy to the US Saburo Kurusu, who was reportedly active in attempting to stop
the outbreak of war, was married to an American and had three children. One of
his sons was supposedly a pilot in the "Japanese Air Force" and
killed in the Pacific.
-
- I don't know
whether Army or Navy - or what type of aircraft. Does anyone have any further
details about his identity or fate?
-
-
Re:
Mystery Pilot Kurusu *PIC*
-
- Posted By:
Hiroyuki Takeuchi <hiryu@bigfoot.com>
- Date:
Tuesday, 21 May 2002, at 6:06 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Mystery Pilot Kurusu (Nick Millman)
-
- Ryo Kurusu
was the son of Saburo and Alice Kurusu and was born in January 1919. He joined
Kawanishi Aircraft in 1940 after graduating the Yokohama Industrial College but
was immediately drafted to the army as a technical officer cadet. He started
flight training in 1941 and became an aviation technical officer.
-
- He was
reportely a good pilot, and tested mainly tested fighter planes at the IJA Air
Testing Unit in Fussa (located at what is now USAF Yokota AB near Tokyo).
-
- He was
killed on February 16, 1945. Witness accounts contradict in small details, but
what happened seem to be this;
-
- Capt. Kurusu
took of in a Ki84 and landed once, reporting one kill. Then as he was walking
to his reloaded planed to take off again, Lt Ryozaburo Umekawa's Ki43 started
taxiing and hit him from behind. His head was chopped off by the by the Ki43's
propeller, killing him on the spot. Since he was considered to be "on
mission", his death was treated as KIA.
-
- All accounts
regarding Ryo Kurusu state that he was a tall and hadsome sportsman, well liked
and respected by those around him.
-
- Kurusu's
photograph is displayed in the war museum in Yasukuni Shrine today.
-
- Editors
note: Picture at http://homepage2.nifty.com/02366/kurusu.jpg
-
-
Re:
Mystery Pilot Kurusu
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Tuesday, 21 May 2002, at 7:16 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: Mystery Pilot Kurusu *PIC* (Hiroyuki Takeuchi)
-
- That is a
most interesting account - thank you very much indeed. Do you know which unit
he was serving in at the time of his death?
-
- A bonus is
the photograph, which provides an excellent close-up of the camouflage pattern
on the Sonia!
-
-
Re:
Mystery Pilot Kurusu
-
- Posted By:
Hiroyuki Takeuchi <hiryu@bigfoot.com>
- Date:
Tuesday, 21 May 2002, at 3:25 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: Mystery Pilot Kurusu (Nick Millman)
-
- He was stil
with the Air Testing Unit; by 1945 they were flying interception missions as
well.
-
-
- Posted By:
emmer <emmer@xs4all.nl>
- Date:
Sunday, 30 June 2002, at 4:49 a.m.
-
- Need desperate
onfomation about the 50th and 60th Sentai and their Chutai's....I know thers a
lidl info of them on the net, but please if anyone knows some more, reply on
this topic....thx....
-
-
50th
Sentai markings
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Wednesday, 3 July 2002, at 1:44 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: INFORMATION NEEDED !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (emmer)
-
- At the
beginning of the Pacific War the 50th Sentai flew the Nakajima Ki-27
"Nate", a fixed undercarriage fighter, and transitioned to the
Nakajima Ki-43 Hayabusa "Oscar" during 1942. They also had a few
Nakajima Ki-44 Shoki "Tojo" on strength and very late in the war
began transition to the Nakajima Ki-84 Hayate "Frank".
-
- The Sentai
marking was a lightning flash running from the tail along the fuselage. The
flash was red for the 1st Chutai, orange or yellow for the 2nd Chutai and white
for the 3rd Chutai. Chutai leaders aircraft were distinguished by a coloured
fuselage band in front of, or replacing, the white so-called "combat
stripe" and often the forward edge of the cowling and spinner were painted
in the Chutai colour.
-
- The deep
orange-yellow paint used on the markings of the early Hayabusa of this Sentai
faded to a pinkish colour which has caused some confusion around Chutai
identification in the past.
-
- Individual
aircraft were "named" with Kanji characters painted in white on the
rudder. There were exceptions but generally the 1st Chutai used the name of
winds - example "Asakaze" (morning wind), the 2nd Chutai the names of
birds and the 3rd Chutai moral exhortations - example "Kou" (filial
piety or reverence).
-
- The 50th
Sentai, 3rd Chutai ace Satoru Anabuki flew one Ki-43 marked in a play on words
with the "name" "Kimikaze", after his wife Kimiko, as well
as another named "Fubuki" (snow storm). Both aircraft displayed
victory markings in the form of enemy roundels painted in white on the fin.
-
- In contrast
to the 59th and 64th Sentai, the 50th Sentai displayed plain red roundels on
the fuselage of the early Ki-43 from the outset - although these were of small,
non-standard size and position.
-
- The 50th
also demonstrated the diversity of camouflage colour schemes and styles as the
64th.
-
-
Re:
50th Sentai markings
-
- Posted By:
Nelson <Rabbo28717@aol.com>
- Date:
Wednesday, 3 July 2002, at 7:58 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: 50th Sentai markings (Nick Millman)
-
- While were
on the subject...Some sources show the undersides of 50th sentai Ki-43 II`s as
being natural metal, others show light grey ....is one or the other
correct...or were both schemes utilzed ?...
-
-
Re:
50th Sentai markings
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Thursday, 4 July 2002, at 12:17 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: 50th Sentai markings (Nelson)
-
- Most of the
II's were delivered in natural metal finish and then painted at the Field Depots
before delivery to frontline units. The most common scheme for this version was
a green mottle applied directly over the natural metal - sometimes sprayed -
sometimes applied with a "brush" - canvas strips nailed to a
broomstick! The mottles varied in style and the skill of execution - some
aircraft had large hard edged blotches creating a veined pattern like the one
common for the Ki-45.
-
- Oscars
returned to the Depots for major overhaul or repair were often extensively
re-painted - if circumstances permitted. It is easy to overlook the fact that
the whole aircraft painting process was determined by the exigencies of the
front and the supply situation - both of aircraft and paint! Maintenance
personnel would not hang about waiting to receive a shipment of
"authentic" Aeromaster Nakajima Green from Japan before re-painting
an Oscar for return to a hard-pressed frontline unit!
-
- "Hold
on Ito! You can't use that paint! It's Kawasaki olive and this is a
Hayabusa!". Hmmm.
-
- Some II's
also appeared in a two-tone green mottle - a darker over lighter green (or
grey-green) - but it is not clear if this was just an effect of the overspray.
In China there were many interesting variations.
-
- The 50th
were unusual in that many of their II's in Burma were painted in a
"kumogata" (cloud - RAF type) scheme of green and brown on the upper
surfaces but that was by no means exclusive. The paint was probably Thai in
origin and the brown had a strong reddish-orange cast. It is possible but by no
means certain that the undersurfaces were painted pale blue-grey or light (sky)
blue. Low contrast colours mean some of these schemes are very difficult to
discern from photographs - conversely patchy and stained single colours often
suggest a two-tone scheme! Photographic interpreters beware!
-
- Oscar II
"5869" of the 50th, abandoned at Akyab and examined (and sketched) by
RAF Intelligence, was reported to have a "mottled mixture of green, brown,
red and blue on the top surface". This was an aircraft of the 3rd Chutai -
the white lightning flash had a thin red outline and there two vertical white
stripes on the fuselage ahead of the flash. Frustratingly the report does not
mention the undersurfaces!
-
- It is very
difficult to be certain about undersurface colours. RAF combat reports in Burma
describe Oscars with silver, "white" "white-ish" and
"faded light blue" undersurfaces. The "white" was perhaps
severely oxidised n/m.
-
- The first
model I's used by the 50th Sentai are usually depicted and described as having
grey-green undersurfaces. However, my personal view is that they were natural
metal.
-
-
Re:
50th Sentai markings
-
- Posted By:
Grant Goodale <grant.goodale@sympatico.ca>
- Date:
Thursday, 4 July 2002, at 6:47 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: 50th Sentai markings (Nick Millman)
-
- I found your
comment about the colours in Burma to be very intriguing. It sounds very much
like an RAF scheme. Just to engage in a flight of fantasy, do you think that it
is likely that the IJAAF captured a large stock of RAF paint and copied the
British idea? The scheme might make a lot of sense in the Burma environment.
-
-
Re:
50th Sentai markings
-
- Posted By:
Nick Millman
- Date:
Thursday, 4 July 2002, at 1:19 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: Re: 50th Sentai markings (Grant Goodale)
-
- I think it's
very possible that these schemes were influenced by RAF camouflage but they
also show remarkable similarity to Thai schemes of the time. The browns were
quite reddish - like the earth colour in parts of Thailand, Indo-China and
South China and some quite bright greens have been recorded as well as the
expected olive shades.
-
- Whichever, I
am convinced that the variety of schemes was related to the environments in
which the aircraft operated.
-
- Certainly
the use of large stocks of captured paint in Burma is confirmed through a
number of sources, including ex-64th Sentai air and ground crew.
-
- We can take
a broader view on this and acknowledge that the photographed aircraft, the
intelligence examination and the surviving relic are all in the minority when
compared to the numbers of aircraft in use. There was more out there than we
think we know! Unwise to be too pedantic about colours
-
-
- Posted By:
Marcus <Itamaensan@gmx.de>
- Date:
Sunday, 29 September 2002, at 3:11 a.m.
-
- What type of
aircraft did Imperial Japanese Army Aircraft Carriers like Akitsu Maru or
Shinshu Maru carry?
-
- Re:
Carrier-Based IJAAF-Aircraft
-
- Posted By:
Hiroyuki Takeuchi
- Date:
Monday, 30 September 2002, at 2:52 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: Carrier-Based IJAAF-Aircraft (Marcus)
-
- The Ki76
STOL planes were used, carrying anti-sub bombs.
-
-
- Posted By:
CJE <cje01@free.fr>
- Date:
Thursday, 26 September 2002, at 4:55 a.m.
-
- I was
surprised to see a Ki.44 with a British fuselage roundel in the Bunrin-Do FAW
series.
- The a/c
belonged to the Akeno fighter school.
- Has anyone
further details:
- - were there
several a/c painted in enemy colors?
- - how were
they used?
- - did they
sport British fin flashes?
-
- Re:
IJAF agressor squadron
-
- Posted By:
Hiroyuki Takeuchi
- Date:
Friday, 27 September 2002, at 2:47 p.m.
-
- In Response
To: IJAF agressor squadron (CJE)
-
- These planes
were used for a Toho produced movie "Kato Hayabusa Sento-tai" which
is a movie released in 1944 about Tateo Kato and the 64th sentai. The IJAF
fully supported this movie and the film was made with captured P-40s as well as
these Ki44s which played the role of RAF Buffalos.
-
- As for the
real agressor role, the Flight Testing Unit based at Fussa sent the ace
Yasuhiko Kuroe and the captured P-51C to home defense units around the Japanese
homelands to give pilots experience in fighting the P-51 escorts that were all
over japan by this time (1945).
-
-
- Posted By:
Jim Broshot <jbroshot@fidnet.com>
- Date:
Wednesday, 18 September 2002, at 7:48 p.m.
-
- Received my
copy of Hata/Izawa/Shores's new book today. I am not a modeller so what how do
the assembled experts rate this effort.
-
- In a first
run through I thought it was better organized than Hata/Izawa's naval fighter
units and aces book (the aces are now listed alphabetically in the biographical
section for one thing).
-
- I'm not an
aviator either, but I was wondering if the Ki-43 was coming in a little bit
high in the astern attack on the B-24 in the cover art. Both the dorsal and
tail turrets bear (although the tail turret seems to be out of commission).
-
- Re:
JAPANESE ARMY AIR FORCE FIGHTER UNITS, etc.
-
- Posted By:
Ken Glass <ken.glass@eudoramail.com>
- Date:
Saturday, 21 September 2002, at 10:41 a.m.
-
- In Response
To: JAPANESE ARMY AIR FORCE FIGHTER UNITS, etc. (Jim Broshot)
-
- I am no
expert but since I also own copies of these books I will venture an opinion. I
have had the Japanese language editions of the IJA and IJN books since the mid
1980s. I can't read Japanese so had to wait like everyone else for the English
translations. I have also read the English edition of the IJN book.
-
- I am at page
220 in my reading through of the IJA book. In my opinion the IJA book is an
easier read than the IJN book. This is partly due to my preference for the
writing style of Mr Shores. It is also due to my preference for IJA subjects
over IJN material. Editorial decisions concerning 'section one' and distribution
of photos in the newest book also contributed as described below. Be warned,
this IS a LONG and multiple books report.
-
- Neither book
gives the degree of highly detailed information of the units as seen in author
Yasuho Izawa's series of articles about the 64th Sentai published in Aero Album
and Air Classics magazines in the